[plug] unsubscibe (newbie's perspective)

[The Thought Assassin]

On Mon, 26 Mar 2001, Mike wrote:
> Are people forgetting something here ?
> a.	Computers can be programmed to perform various tasks,
> 	easy to program it to handle unsub requests from the list
> 	members as well as via an admin list. Simple logic could
> 	handle the very requests (and several exceptions) that
> 	have recently occured.

ROFL. Your faith in computers is touching, but unrealistic. :(

> b.	Wouldn't it be a nice demonstration of the powers of linux
> 	and cooperative intent of the group (vis a vis linux came
> 	together via open source cooperation), if the list software
> 	were expertly programmed to minimise non-effective list
> 	traffic - such as unsub requests, spam, bounces etc etc

We don't seem to get many spams or bounces, thankfully. (well done, Matt)
The problems only start when you have actual list-members (the people we
trust, basically) doing foolish things. The trick is not to subscribe
fools, or to subscribe then educate them. That's only slightly easier.

> 	Note: Its occured to me that to handle erroneous traps
> 	on unsub requests, the list s/w email the person who
> 	made the request informing them of being unsubbed, that
> 	way if some poor plebe stumbles upon an unsub request whilst
> 	making a bonafide list message then they get alerted.

By which time they have missed how many messages? A big inconvenience to a
list-member instead of a small inconvenience to an ex-list-member? Why?

> c.	Linux is slowly getting some recognition and we need all the
> 	newbies we can get and then some more,

Not sure why you would say this. I certainly don't need newbies. :)

> the last thing you want to do is restrict in any way acess to learning
> and discussing with others linux and its issues.

Doesn't anyone here favour quality over quantity? The signal/noise ratio
is the standard test of a forum's effectiveness, and for good reason.

> 	IMNSHO: REstricting subscriptions is like restricting education
> 	(which should be totally free - and I'm a capitalist).

So you are not in favour of excluding children from a school when their
behaviour prevents the effective education of other children?

> 	Here's a thought: For newbies, the list s/w append a note
> 	re where the FAQ is (as well as unsub info) for a rolling
> 	average number of messages. Say if person 'x' only emails
> 	once a month then they get a suffix note re FAQ and Unsub,
> 	if people send to the list more then 3 times a month or
> 	so then they get no suffix FAQ or unsub info.
> 	In fact, the list s/w should also send a FAQ/Unsub to anyone
> 	once each 6 months etc etc This is not mutally exclusive
> 	with list s/w handling unsubs sent to list,

If people receive something more than once, they will only read it the
first time, regardless of whether they comprehended it initially. I am
Jack's bitter experience.

> Its amazing that people who have programming experience tend to be
> less aware of their impact on others and can become so arrogant to assume
> those without programming experience can not come up with solutions to
> computer related problems.

and it is equally amazing that people who don't have programming
experience think that programmers should be able to come up with software
solutions to social problems.
While on the subject, a programmer understands the merits of out-of-band
control signalling, but non-programmers seem to arrogantly assume that
because they don't understand the merit, its not real.

> I could do it in assembler with a bleedin Z80, it ain't that hard
> - is it ?

Yes, as a matter of fact, it is.

-Greg Mildenhall