[plug] [OT+link] Feeling secure? Want to stay that way? Then don't read this.

[Russell]

On Fri, Dec 27, 2002 at 02:57:12AM -0000, sscott at iinet.net.au wrote:
> > > if some of them are wrongly accused. 
...
> > > peaceful and good to your fellow man, then you have nothing to fear.
> > Do you see the contradiction here?  This is the the reason we have
> > this thing called due process.  It should be extended to everyone.
> 
> Not at all! You forget one important distinction - us and them. 

It seems that "us" is people in the western world, and "them" is
anyone else.  (Mmmm, I'm trying hard to believe that your statement
here has a hidden winking smiley?  Does it?)

> Actually, we are kinda arguing the same point - we both think its revenge, 
> but have different positions on whether thats a bad thing or a good thing.

You're right here.

> > BTW, I don't believe you'd feel the same way if you or your family
> > were wrongly accused.
> 
> Thats the point - my family wouldnt be wrongly accused. We are on 
> the 'good side'. If youre part of the 'bad side', or sit somewhere in the 
> grey area in between, then you may be wrongly accused. Lesson: make sure 
> you're on the 'good side'.

How do you ensure that?  Is is by being born in the right place?  With
the currently presented situation it seems impossible for someone to
be born and live in Afghanistan (probably soon to be other places;
this is a roaming sideshow) and be safe from a wrong accusation and
its ensuing possible torture.

And are you so sure you couldn't be wrongly accused?  There have been
armed raids by Federal Police in Australia recently.  Another suspect
might remember your name from somewhere (this list, perhaps) recite it
under torture, and suddenly you are a suspect.  ("Why do you have this
gpg encryption thing on your computer?  And our scientists think that
these jpegs have hidden watermarks.  Tell us about them.")

> BTW, I don't believe you'd feel the same way if you or your family were 
> directly threatened by extremists with guns and explosives. 

Or threatened by the US Army or CIA or Australian Federal Police or
ASIO with guns and explosives.

"Terrorists" come in many forms.  Some of them wear uniforms and are
paid by very large governments.