[plug] SuSE Linux

[Bernd Felsche]

On Tue, Mar 25, 2003 at 10:14:23PM +0800, Derek Fountain wrote:
> > > Yes, it's relatively pricey, coming from Europe, and with a
> > > company with a business model which might have them survive for a
> > > while. You also pay for a really good and well maintained
> > > distribution. When it comes to engineering - cars or software -
> > > that Germanic attention to detail really makes their products
> > > stand out as top quality.

> > Far be it from me to dispell that illusion... it's mostly hype.

> Um, which bit is hype? The pricey bit? The business model bit? The good 
> distribution bit? Or the Germanic quality bit? Or all of it? ;o)

The Germanic attention to detail. e.g. nn, as distributed with SuSE
since 7.3 has been broken. Wouldn't work at all properly with
leafnode, and *really* out of date. Yeah.. only one of 2800
packages, but it's so badly broken that it doesn't work at all.

Free software solution is to delete the package download the current
version, compile and install. No great shakes if you know how; but
it should at least work as installed off the CD/DVD.

> > SuSE deliberately aim their product at the "professional/hobbyist"
> > so their product appears to be better than most other distributions
> > that are aimed more at the "techo".
> 
> I'm not sure I understand your point. Are you saying it "appears
> to be better" but isn't? How have they achieved that?!

Well, it's "better" for the target audience. Realistically speaking,
SuSE's distribution is comprehensive, well-supported and quite well
integrated... but so are others; albeit in their own way.
SuSE is never bleeding edge; unless you take out the knives and
sharpen them yourself!

> I like SuSE because their kernel has lots of recent patches, all
> well integrated and tested, KDE is well setup, and YaST is an
> excellent control centre. They have a graphical interface (or a
> text interface if you prefer that) to vast amounts of standard
> configuration jobs (second only to smitty under AIX in my
> experience) and they are right on the ball with patches and
> updates. They don't do stupid things like ship unofficial compiler
> versions, and they don't cripple the desktop for political ends.

I assume that you're also on their security announce list and are
anxiously awaiting the dozen or so patches in progress. These are
mostly pre-emptive strikes; code-review showing up potential
problems and the suggested patches being rolled into the SuSE rpm
and patch rpms having been tested.

> SuSE is probably on the more technical side of the range of
> distros, but only just. For me it gets the balance right between
> trying to help and getting in the way of someone who knows what
> they're doing.

Stability is one of SuSE's strengths. They certainly don't go all
out and try to put absolutely the latest kernel in a _distribution_.
What you do with Mantel is your own problem!

> > As for pricing, I think it's not too far away from the other
> > mainstream commercial distributions... Redhat RRPs are priced around
> > the same as SuSE's for nominally-comparable products.
> 
> The difference being that you can pick up RHL for free from the
> 'net. You can't with SuSE.

You can't get the ISO images. Not through the expected channels.
You will probably find somebody's ISO images online somewhere - but
I don't believe that there is a great number of potential
downloaders when they see a 4.7GB image.

Downloading is hardly "free". Nominal cost is still over
10c/megabyte.

> > DVDs - two of, in packet, plus 5 CD. I assume that the 5 CD's
> > contain the most-frequently-used stuff - and the DVDs contain plenty
> > of other fruit.
> 
> Not quite. The 5 CDs and 1 DVD are basically the same: install the
> distro from whichever media you can use. The extra DVD is just for
> the sources. So, AFAIK, anyone should be able to copy the 5 CDs
> and have everything they need to make the distro run. No need to
> copy the DVDs unless you want the convenience and sources,
> respectively.

I'm surprised you know what's on each of them in the 8.2 version...
it's not even officially available in Germany until next week.

In the past DVD plus CD distributions, the DVD has been a superset
of what's on the CDs. Loads of extras, space permitting (there
wasn't much extra with 8.1). Sources have previously fit on one CD.
And 8.1 came on 7 CDs plus the DVD with the "same stuff" on it.

I can't see how SuSE can deliver even more packages (how many got
smaller?) on fewer CD's, yet require a DVD to hold the sources for
what's on the other 5 CD's.

> Of course, it ain't out yet, so I could be wrong. The beta code
> was shipped as 5 CD ISO images, nothing more.

-- 
/"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia
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