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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Very true. Can I just say, depending on
the industry you’re getting into (IT department in a Mining/Resources, or
cryptography/security firm, etc) would yield far different salaries than those
mentioned for the job listed. I have a friend who’s 1 year Post graduate
working at Rio Tinto on Embedded systems and looking at almost $70k, as well as
another friend who has no degree or higher education and is working in IT
Management for OneSteel in Perth at >$60k.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I believe without a doubt the money is
still there (especially as Shayne said, and specialise in something), in
security, Cisco or HPUX??/AIX in a network/server environment or even High
grade Java or .NET development. While I was job hunting I saw many Senior
Development roles in C#.NET going for $100,000+.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><st1:place w:st="on"><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Shannon</span></font></st1:place><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:windowtext;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;color:windowtext'> plug-bounces@plug.org.au [mailto:plug-bounces@plug.org.au]
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Daniel Pearson
(Flashware Solutions)<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Thursday, 9 November 2006
12:53 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> plug@plug.org.au<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [plug] iiNet job on
Seek</span></font><font color=black><span lang=EN-US style='color:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>And also to note - working in the industry myself and
rubbing shoulders with a lot of other companies out there - that same job at
iiNet would be offered at another company, with for example a 60k starting
salary.<br>
<br>
As the old saying goes - if you pay peanuts, you'll get monkeys (or whoever it
goes..). That is the problem I see with that job for iiNet, and perhaps why it
has been advertised so often / had such a high turnover rate. If you want
quality employment, then its simple - you pay for it.<br>
<br>
Just my $0.02 worth.. YMMV :)<br>
<br>
Cheers</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
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<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><strong><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Daniel Pearson</span></font></b></strong><b><font
size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;font-weight:
bold'><br>
</span></font></b><font size=1 face=Arial><span style='font-size:7.5pt;
font-family:Arial'>Flashware Solutions ABN 58 438 456 919</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
7.5pt;font-family:Arial'>Mob: 0438 118 897 | Email: </span></font><font
face=Arial><span style='font-family:Arial'><a href="mailto:daniel@flashware.net"><font
size=1><span style='font-size:7.5pt'>daniel@flashware.net</span></font></a></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=1 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
7.5pt;font-family:Arial'><br>
The information contained in this electronic transmission is confidential. If
you are not the intended recipient of this transmission, use of this
information is strictly prohibited. If you have received this
transmission in error, please contact Flashware Solutions 0438 118 897.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
<br>
Shayne O'Neill wrote: <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<pre wrap=""><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>No, you can make that sort of money, if you just specialise right.<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>The big hint I've been told is to do a security degreee with an IT<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>minor. IT security guys with a security degrees can make mindboggling<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>somes of cash. A guy I know went straight from uni to nearly $300k .<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>That's absurd, and entirely achievable with a degree in security. <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>-----Original Message-----<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>From: <a
href="mailto:plug-bounces@plug.org.au">plug-bounces@plug.org.au</a> [<a
href="mailto:plug-bounces@plug.org.au">mailto:plug-bounces@plug.org.au</a>] On<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Behalf Of Gavin Chester<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Sent: Thursday, 9 November 2006 12:47 PM<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>To: <a
href="mailto:plug@plug.org.au">plug@plug.org.au</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Subject: Re: [plug] iiNet job on Seek<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>On Thu, 2006-11-09 at 12:27 +0800, Tomasz Grzegurzko wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' type=cite><pre wrap=""><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>On 11/9/06, Tomasz Grzegurzko <a
href="mailto:tomasz89@gmail.com"><tomasz89@gmail.com></a> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' type=cite><pre wrap=""><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>On 11/9/06, Gavin Chester <a
href="mailto:sales@ecosolutions.com.au"><sales@ecosolutions.com.au></a> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' type=cite><pre wrap=""><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>On Thu, 2006-11-09 at 11:55 +0800, Tomasz Grzegurzko wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' type=cite>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' type=cite><pre wrap=""><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Just for my curiosity, what would you expect to get in a job <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>such as that?<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre></blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>-snip lots of useful answer -<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' type=cite>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' type=cite><pre wrap=""><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>For a programming job, requiring a decent amount of skill (and this <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>one sounds like it) I'd say at least >$40k for someone like myself.<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>'Course that depends on the person, for me I'm worth every penny<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre></blockquote>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>hehe.<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font size=2
color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Thanks for such a comprehensive answer. I am surprised that salary<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>levels aren't what I had expected them to be - falling short by a long<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>way. I'm a life-sciences graduate and the salaries you quote are on par<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>with what people in my field could expect for comparable<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>seniority/experience. I had suffered under the delusion that IT with<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>good degree(s) and several years experience could easily expect<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>$150K-$250K. So is that only the few lucky to work freelance, or<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>what? <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' type=cite>
<blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt' type=cite><pre wrap=""><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Cheers,<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Tomasz<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre></blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>Sorry for THIS job they want heaps of skills and I agree with <st1:place
w:st="on">Shannon</st1:place>.<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font size=2
color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>I was talking more generically about programming.<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre></blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>And, thanks to you for your input, <st1:place
w:st="on">Shannon</st1:place>. I must say, you have put me<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>in my place regarding my expectations of IT salaries :-(. The reason<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>for my curiosity is because my wife often says "you spend so much<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>god-damn time on that computer, why don't you put it to _real_ use and<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>retrain in IT to bring home decent money!" :-) Maybe not, eh?<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Gavin. <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>PLUG discussion list: <a
href="mailto:plug@plug.org.au">plug@plug.org.au</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><a
href="http://www.plug.org.au/mailman/listinfo/plug">http://www.plug.org.au/mailman/listinfo/plug</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Committee e-mail: <a
href="mailto:committee@plug.linux.org.au">committee@plug.linux.org.au</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>PLUG discussion list: <a
href="mailto:plug@plug.org.au">plug@plug.org.au</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><a
href="http://www.plug.org.au/mailman/listinfo/plug">http://www.plug.org.au/mailman/listinfo/plug</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Committee e-mail: <a
href="mailto:committee@plug.linux.org.au">committee@plug.linux.org.au</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre></div>
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